Judge Patrick Carroll makes his point!

The jumping off discussion area for the rest of the Deck. All things Lakewood.
Please check out our other sections. As we refile many discussions from the past into
their proper sections please check them out and offer suggestions.

Moderators: Jim DeVito, Dan Alaimo

stephen davis
Posts: 595
Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2005 9:49 pm
Location: lakewood, ohio

Postby stephen davis » Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:16 pm

"Even if the court has to hire their own inspectors."



WOW!

I nominate this "Best Idea by an Elected Official - 2007".

Finally, Lakewood voters get some representation where we need it most, Housing and Rentals. The city's approach to these issues has seemed to be a bit random, or at best, uneven. I know that if Judge Carroll takes this on, it will be consistent, fair, and in the best interest of the city.

Keep up the good work Your Honor.


Nothin' shakin' on Shakedown Street.
Used to be the heart of town.
Don't tell me this town ain't got no heart.
You just gotta poke around.

Robert Hunter/Sometimes attributed to Ezra Pound.
David Anderson
Posts: 375
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 12:41 pm

Postby David Anderson » Fri Jun 01, 2007 3:13 pm

Former Cleveland city councilman, Ray Pianka, now Judge Pianka, started Cleveland's housing court about a decade ago. He wouldn't remember me asking him about progress made so I'll paraphrase his comments: if the court levies hefty fines on landlords to pay for inspectors the landlords won't have money for repairs; jailing a landlord takes away any potential for income to pay for repairs/hot water bills.

How can a landlords pay for repairs if they can't even afford the fine? How can landlords pay the fine if they can't afford the repair?

The bottom line is that the home/building needs repairs or utility bills need payment to end the suffering of tenants.

That poor utility owning landlord Judge Carrol ordered to take residence in his own property is enduring cold showers. Hard time, eh! Did this get the bill paid? Would a fine get the bill paid faster?

I don’t have the answers but hope Judge Carrol and our city leaders research this issue a bit more before another layer of government bureaucracy is created with no viable ability to sustain itself other than a taxpayer bailout.


stephen davis
Posts: 595
Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2005 9:49 pm
Location: lakewood, ohio

Postby stephen davis » Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:14 pm

David Anderson wrote:That poor utility owning landlord...



Maybe the poor landlord should get into another line of work.


Nothin' shakin' on Shakedown Street.
Used to be the heart of town.
Don't tell me this town ain't got no heart.
You just gotta poke around.

Robert Hunter/Sometimes attributed to Ezra Pound.
Suzanne Metelko
Posts: 221
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 2:55 pm

Postby Suzanne Metelko » Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:25 pm

David Anderson wrote:I don’t have the answers but hope Judge Carrol and our city leaders research this issue a bit more before another layer of government bureaucracy is created with no viable ability to sustain itself other than a taxpayer bailout.


I'm not sure what you mean by another layer. The Judge took the initiative to make the punishment for this crime effective for the victims and the perpetrator.

He can't go home until they're fixed. In jail, he wouldn't be home and they wouldn't be fixed. A fine would be great for the court's budget but it wouldn't get the properties fixed. And in the meantime, the revenue that he would have continued to receive while in jail, is now going to the court. Bills are getting paid, repairs are getting done, Naumann is receiving his punishment. What's not to like?


“The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter.â€
User avatar
Jim O'Bryan
Posts: 12155
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 10:12 pm
Location: Lakewood
Contact:

Postby Jim O'Bryan » Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:56 pm

Suzanne Metelko wrote:I'm not sure what you mean by another layer. The Judge took the initiative to make the punishment for this crime effective for the victims and the perpetrator.


Suzanne

I thin Dave was referring to another layer of housing inspectors. Those of us with rentals, especially people that keep them up like Dave does(I live within eye site of one), and myself, ponder how others get away with it!

Read Dave's reply over the license. We both have them and get inspected and sighted every year. Two years ago I was cited for 1 weed in a gutter, and paint on my garage that looked ready to peel! Dave's rental is very nice. So we both are amazed at house like the one on Beach that is falling apart, This guy not having hot water, etc. I do not think either of us have ever thought of these things as optional in Lakewood.

Another layer of fairness was the Judge told Naumann, that all of the rent the courts were collecting could be used with prior OK to fix the place as fast as he wanted to. That Naumann would stay until the last repair was finished. I have to think this was extremely fair. Other wise the rent was being collected for the city to bring them up to code.

If you cannot afford the bar business do not buy a bar. If you cannot afford a coffee shop do not start one. If you cannot fix or afford to pay people to fix properties get out of the landlord business.

FWIW


.


Jim O'Bryan
Lakewood Resident

"The very act of observing disturbs the system."
Werner Heisenberg

"If anything I've said seems useful to you, I'm glad.
If not, don't worry. Just forget about it."
His Holiness The Dalai Lama
DougHuntingdon
Posts: 527
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2006 10:29 pm

Postby DougHuntingdon » Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:12 pm

><><><><><
If you cannot afford the bar business do not buy a bar. If you cannot afford a coffee shop do not start one. If you cannot fix or afford to pay people to fix properties get out of the landlord business.
><><><><><

I can't believe I am saying this, but I think I have to agree with JOB on this one. Perhaps too many are watching Carleton Sheets' infomercials and think real estate is an easy get-rich-quick scheme at which any amateur can succeed.

Bad luck can happen to anyone. However, one of the reasons why there are so many nuisance properties is that a lot of slumlords or homeowners have bitten off more than they can chew. People are owning property who have no business owning it. Others are just amateurs and have little skills...not everyone can be Dave or JOB or Donald Trump. Even if they started out being a good slumlord, for instance, they end up skimping on repairs or being less selective with tenants. I used to know one that stopped doing relatively inexpensive background checks (from Lakewood's own Security Hut, I think) because he couldn't afford the $25 or whatever. Then he ended up getting problem tenants that previously would have been screened out and got himself into an even bigger mess. You can actually do a lot of checking on the internet without having to pay someone, if you are really trying to cut costs. Some landlords are on really hard times and will take anyone as a tenant as long as they come up with first month's rent and security deposit. A lot of them refi and second mortgage themselves to the max. Despite what some people think, housing is not very liquid. It's often not that easy to sell property quickly, even if you are willing to sell at a good price compared to comparable properties. I know a lot of properties in Lakewood that have been for sale for 2 or 3 years at least.

Doug


User avatar
Jim O'Bryan
Posts: 12155
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 10:12 pm
Location: Lakewood
Contact:

Postby Jim O'Bryan » Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:18 pm

DougHuntingdon wrote:Perhaps too many are watching Carleton Sheets' infomercials and think real estate is an easy get-rich-quick scheme at which any amateur can succeed.


Doug

This is exactly what happened here I believe. It seems he rolled, equity over very quickly. Nothing illegal, just working the system. Problem is when you work anything to the limits, failure is just a trip away.

Housing is no longer liquid, there were years about a decade ago, but those days are gone I believe. I cannot speak for Dave, he dresses like Donald Trump, while I prefer jeans and shirts. We both believe rentals are easy. Keep them like an apartment you would like to live in. Go figure

Another thing I believe that might makes us different, we are not afraid waiting for good tenants. Yes we both rent to minorities, but we want people that like the property and will respect it. Seems simple.

I know this sounds odd. But I own a rental in my neighborhood. Where I grew up, and now live. I owe it to my neighbors to find good neighbors, and good tenants. Don't need crack heads, don't need to hear it at the block party!

FWIW


.


Jim O'Bryan
Lakewood Resident

"The very act of observing disturbs the system."
Werner Heisenberg

"If anything I've said seems useful to you, I'm glad.
If not, don't worry. Just forget about it."
His Holiness The Dalai Lama
David Anderson
Posts: 375
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2006 12:41 pm

Postby David Anderson » Fri Jun 01, 2007 8:52 pm

Suzanne Metelko wrote:
David Anderson wrote:I don’t have the answers but hope Judge Carrol and our city leaders research this issue a bit more before another layer of government bureaucracy is created with no viable ability to sustain itself other than a taxpayer bailout.


I'm not sure what you mean by another layer. The Judge took the initiative to make the punishment for this crime effective for the victims and the perpetrator.

He can't go home until they're fixed. In jail, he wouldn't be home and they wouldn't be fixed. A fine would be great for the court's budget but it wouldn't get the properties fixed. And in the meantime, the revenue that he would have continued to receive while in jail, is now going to the court. Bills are getting paid, repairs are getting done, Naumann is receiving his punishment. What's not to like?


Suzanne - A previous message, on page two I think, suggested that a Lakewood Housing Court could be paid for through fines. I don't think this is possible if the goal is to fix properties. So, we, the taxpayers, would be on the hook for another governmental agency. The issue of paying for this new layer of government is what I would be concerned about.

It's been a couple of weeks since Naumann was sentenced to his own building. Has the gas bill been payed? What's potentially "not to like" is the fact that if a supposed housing court were to have uncovered this mess, sent another squad of inspectors, etc., then there is no way Nauman would have been able to pay a fine and fix the heat/hot water and the heat/hot water would undoubtedly take precedent. Who's to pay for the efforts of the housing court?

(Stephen - My previous referral to Naumann is the "poor landlord" was meant as sarcasm.)



Return to “Lakewood General Discussions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests